LOCKED- READ THREAD, BUYER BEWARE - Xoxbox group buy ~ $450?
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Tue May 25, 2010 11:37 am

phono wrote:...2sc1815...
thats pretty curious since its not mentioned in any of the service notes i have, even the ones with the errata pages


Most of the references I see on this part are on japanese web pages like this wikipedia article:
http://translate.google.com/translate?h ... %26hl%3Den

Of course, a Wiki article doesnt make it true.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by isak on Tue May 25, 2010 12:48 pm

Thanks all, especially Isak for all your hard work on this!

first.. let me thank you for the chance u gave us here in Israel.
second.. i was very happy to work with you :)
and third as the famous Astral Projection track say.. "LET THERE BE LIGHT" 8)
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Fri May 28, 2010 8:41 pm

The order has been placed. 13 units were ordered.
9 in Israel and 4 in the USA.

Cy says the units should be shipped by next Friday.

I will post details and photos here as the buy progresses. Stay tuned.

If anyone is interested, but missed the buy, PM me and I will collect email addresses.
If we can collect another 12 we might be able to organize another buy later this summer.

-Dan G.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by adafruit on Fri May 28, 2010 9:54 pm

hello everyone, phil from support here. if you placed an order with cy i suggest you ask the order to go on hold for now - we have been trying to contact cy and his fax machine is disconnected, email accounts bouncing, mail address is sketchy (he's really in china) and phone numbers did not work. cy promised to get back to us and he has not.

the issue is - he is taking credit for the x0xb0x, mass manufacturing x0xb0xes, selling them for profit and refuses to abide by the license on our page:
http://www.ladyada.net/make/x0xb0x/download.html

we asked that he credit us as the designer and link to our site, pretty simple. i asked dan (in these forums, coordinating a group buy) to consider holding off on on the sale because this feels very wrong to take money while this happening. dan has been very helpful trying to convince cy to credit us (and other buyers have also told cy to do this) but cy has refused and also not responded to our emails.

we're giving this another 24 hours and then we'll figure out what we need to do.

if you bought one of these please contact us directly, perhaps you can help us resolve this. $6k to a stranger who is across the world and not doing a simple thing like crediting the designers of the product they're now selling and making money from is a bad sign and we do not want anyone to lose their money, or worse, damage the project's reputation and fun.

here's is the latest email/fax we sent to cy after dozens of emails and attempts.

To: Chahae Yasaena 2305 Celina Dr. 73130-7530 Midwest City, OK United States Phone: 405-277-0889 Fax: 877-254-0629 Email: chipforbrains@yahoo.com, technology.transplant@gmail.com, spectrumleds@yahoo.com, 236249813@qq.com

Attention Chahae Yasaena (“cy”)
As per our email, this fax contains the written request that you (chipsforbrains, technology transplant) immediately update your page (http://www.technologytransplant.com/xox ... tinfo.html), eBay pages, documentation and circuit boards to reflect the following:
1. Credit Adafruit as the designer, creator and copyright holder of the x0xb0x. "x0xb0x originally designed by Adafruit industries" with a link to: http://www.adafruit.com
2. Also, add the credit(s) to the circuit board if you're selling it which it appears you are.
3. Your document hosted on your site also contains our text without permission. We will grant you permission to use it pro- vided you credit Adafruit as the designer and creator of the x0xb0x. "x0xb0x originally designed by Adafruit industries" with a link to: http://www.adafruit.com http://technologytransplant.com/xoxbox/UserManual2.doc
Please let us know if you have any questions or wish to discuss this matter. Please make these updates and changes by end of business day 5/28/2010 - we understand the circuit boards may require a sticker or intermediate solution until the next board run.


cy's address says "Chahae Yasaena 2305 Celina Dr. 73130-7530 Midwest City, OK United States" but he is actually in China - Guangdong, Guangzhou. if you're a buyer you should request his real address whatever that might be.

his ebay store states that he is in the united states http://myworld.ebay.com/chipforbrains/ but he's operating from outside the usa. ebay usually does not allow or like when someone says they're in the usa in the "Business Seller Information" area and they're actually in another country. for business sellers this is usually against their terms of services for the protection of the buyers.
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-BLUE-LED-XOXBOX ... 439f7790e3
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Fri May 28, 2010 11:08 pm

As I said to you via PM, I asked Cy to add a link to adafruit to his x0xb0x page, He has shown me an update that contains said link. He in no way claims to have invented the x0xb0x. The user manual in question says that the x0xb0x was invented by Adafriut and contains a link to your site.

I dont know why he has not posted said link on his x0xb0x details page yet, but I will ask him to do so again.

Keep in mind that all units will be delivered as described and will have the promised 1 year warranty.

This squabble has left a bad taste in my mouth and as such, I cannot participate any further in the "New CPU" and "New Firmware" projects I started in the x0xmods forum until Adafruit and Technology Transplant resolve their differences.

Its just a damn link people! A public hissy fit defaming Cy and myself over the lack a damn link for 3 days? Really!?

I have been working hard trying to contribute something very substantial to the x0xb0x community and I am getting sick of these petty political squabbles.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by phono on Sat May 29, 2010 1:34 am

Helyx525 wrote:Its just a damn link people


Dan you have to appreciate that it's not "just a damn link" its a copyright issue and Adafruit are well within their rights to ask for their credit, especially if someone is profiting from their hard work.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Sat May 29, 2010 2:07 am

phono wrote:Dan you have to appreciate that it's not "just a damn link" its a copyright issue and Adafruit are well within their rights to ask for their credit, especially if someone is profiting from their hard work.


I agree with both you and Adafruit. Cy should post the link. But they requested it only 3 days ago.
xoxshop.de has been around a long longer and I see no mention of Adafruit anywhere on their site.

Why the selective enforcement? I think the are angry about Cy's email earlier and it seems very over the top to imply that Cy is an untrustworthy seller simply because he is slow in responding to their demands.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by adafruit on Sat May 29, 2010 2:10 am

phono wrote:Dan you have to appreciate that it's not "just a damn link" its a copyright issue and Adafruit are well within their rights to ask for their credit, especially if someone is profiting from their hard work.


thanks phono.

Helyx525 wrote:I agree with both you and Adafruit. Cy should post the link. But they requested it only 3 days ago.
xoxshop.de has been around a long longer and I see no mention of Adafruit anywhere on their site. Why the selective enforcement? I think the are angry about Cy's email earlier and it seems very over the top to imply that Cy is an untrustworthy seller simply because he is slow in responding to their demands.


hi, phil here - i'm currently working on getting cy to update his pages, xoxshop.de credits us, cy needs to update his page and not worry about others. the sooner cy does this, the sooner i can move on to other things - he said he would update them, that time has passed - he is about to take $6k from all the group buyers, if i was a customer i would want to know what was going on. if he can't update a site and credit the people who made what he is selling that's usually a bad sign.

dan, i'm sorry to hear you're not going to contribute to the project for now - i think this is a good example of what happens when a simple request of credit is ignored, it really damages a project and motivation. imagine how we feel, someone is selling our creative work and will not credit us as we clearly state for usage. cy said he was going to credit us, you claim to have seen an updated page, this should be resolved by now right?
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by phono on Sat May 29, 2010 2:25 am

Helyx525 wrote:
phono wrote:Dan you have to appreciate that it's not "just a damn link" its a copyright issue and Adafruit are well within their rights to ask for their credit, especially if someone is profiting from their hard work.

xoxshop.de has been around a long longer and I see no mention of Adafruit anywhere on their site.


x0xsh0p are giving credit, on the first sentance of their description of the x0xb0x it says

(in german)

die x0xb0x (gesprochen: socksbox) ist die entwicklung von MIT studenten, die sich zum ziel gesetzt hatten, einen 303 klon zu bauen, der so nah am original wie möglich ist.

(googlish translation)

the x0xb0x (pronounced socksbox) is the development of MIT students who had set the goal to build a clone 303, close to the original as possible is so.

and the link leads to http://ladyada.net/make/x0xb0x/index.html
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by adafruit on Sat May 29, 2010 2:32 am

phono wrote:x0xsh0p are giving credit, on the first sentence of their description of the x0xb0x it says
(in german)
die x0xb0x (gesprochen: socksbox) ist die entwicklung von MIT studenten, die sich zum ziel gesetzt hatten, einen 303 klon zu bauen, der so nah am original wie möglich ist.
(googlish translation)
the x0xb0x (pronounced socksbox) is the development of MIT students who had set the goal to build a clone 303, close to the original as possible is so. and the link leads to http://ladyada.net/make/x0xb0x/index.html


thanks again phono. if cy did exactly this from the start we would not have any need to contact him. cy keeps saying what "about x0xsh0p" and we keep saying not to worry others, just update your site as you promised.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Sat May 29, 2010 3:22 am

adafruit wrote:dan, i'm sorry to hear you're not going to contribute to the project for now - i think this is a good example of what happens when a simple request of credit is ignored, it really damages a project and motivation. imagine how we feel, someone is selling our creative work and will not credit us as we clearly state for usage. cy said he was going to credit us, you claim to have seen an updated page, this should be resolved by now right?

I agree it should be resolved by now, but I also feel that we should not be at DEFCON1 over a missing link after a few days.

I know its not much, but please note that you are given credit and a link in the user manual on cy's page.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Sat May 29, 2010 3:23 am

phono wrote:x0xsh0p are giving credit, on the first sentance of their description of the x0xb0x it says

:oops: I dont know how I missed that. Sorry.
I saw the MIT link but somehow missed that it was connected to ladyada.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by adafruit on Sat May 29, 2010 3:44 am

Helyx525 wrote:I agree it should be resolved by now, but I also feel that we should not be at DEFCON1 over a missing link after a few days. I know its not much, but please note that you are given credit and a link in the user manual on cy's page.


dan - we need to get cy to update his page - you said he updated it, but where is it?
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by Helyx525 on Sat May 29, 2010 6:12 am

I think I finally have a clearer picture of what has happened and I must apologize that this misunderstanding is partly my fault.

Some members and Forum mods here were asking a few weeks ago for Cy to post a page on the TT website detailing the x0xbox to verify that this buy was authentic.

I asked Cy to do this and he wanted to know what to post. I told him he simply needed to post the info from the ebay auction and the part selection info from his public email message. He was following my directions, and I didnt know about the attribution requirement until after the emails started flying.

Now Cy is not an experienced web site admin and in attempting to post the info page he says he crashed the TT website for 24 hours. He was told in no uncertain terms that he was not allowed to touch the TT website again and any further changes would have to wait until his boss returned from vacation at the end of May.

This is why he was not able to update the page this week. He was not trying to ignore or disrespect you, he just couldnt change it until next week and he couldnt get that across to you.

In the meantime, on Monday or Tuesday, he emailed me and asked me to review a draft of the next update for the page. He asked me to do this because he said he has a tendency to ramble some times and we did not want a repeat of the first email. I sent him my suggested revisions and when Adafruit PMed me asking about the missing link, I told them in all honesty that I had just reviewed the next page update and the first line in it was a link to adafruit as the designer.
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Re: completed Xoxbox group buy, ~ $450?

by adafruit on Sat May 29, 2010 6:21 am

Helyx525 wrote: Cy is not an experienced web site admin and in attempting to post the info page he says he crashed the TT website for 24 hours. He was told in no uncertain terms that he was not to touch the website again and any further changes would have to wait until his boss returned from vacation at the end of May. This is why he was not able to update the page this week. He was not trying to ignore or disrespect you, he just couldnt do it until next week and he couldnt get that across to you.


this story sounds unlikely to me. crashing a server? because of a html link? boss out town? if that's all true, why would he do a sale with about $6k at stake? sounds like the group buy should be on hold until this is resolved for the safety of all the customers? if i were a customer this would all freak me out.

dan, please do not take the blame for this. we do not understand why you are speaking for him, please have visit here. if he wants to express his feelings about what is going on, please do not be his go-between.

cy has said and promised many things but none of them appeared here or on his site that he was going to credit us as the designers of the product he is selling. in fact, he implied the opposite in our opinion. cy can post here and be clear about his intentions and he can also stop using you to post what is going on. please tell cy to post here and confirm exactly what he is going to do and when. he can take care of this immediately and i can work on more important things.
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