How do I copy SIM cards??

Talk about the videos and projects (SIM reader, payphones...)

Moderators: adafruit_support_bill, adafruit

Please be positive and constructive with your questions and comments.
Locked
User avatar
rancidbry
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:34 am

How do I copy SIM cards??

Post by rancidbry »

Does the software for extracting SIM information also make duplicate SIM cards, including the secret key code?
Where can I download the brute force cracking software?
I'm addicted to Ada kits!

User avatar
rancidbry
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:34 am

the Ki

Post by rancidbry »

I realize the new SIM cards can't be cracked. Why can't SIM cards be completely cloned without cracking the Ki? Is there a way to copy the SIM to an older card then crack it? There must be a way!

adafruit
 
Posts: 12151
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 4:21 pm

Post by adafruit »

because the Ki is necessary to authenticate the card

User avatar
rancidbry
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 2:34 am

Copying the Ki

Post by rancidbry »

I guess I'm thinking about this the wrong way.
Why can't the SIM card be copied as if it were a piece of paper in a copy machine? Even though the data is encrypted it still should be possible to copy. Can't wait for the kit!

adafruit
 
Posts: 12151
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 4:21 pm

Post by adafruit »

because is not a piece of paper, its a microcomputer

lou
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:39 am

Re: Copying the Ki

Post by lou »

rancidbry wrote:I guess I'm thinking about this the wrong way.
Why can't the SIM card be copied as if it were a piece of paper in a copy machine? Even though the data is encrypted it still should be possible to copy. Can't wait for the kit!
You could copy a SIM card exactly as if it were a piece of paper in a copy machine. The problem with that, though, is that you'd only end up with a picture of a SIM card. Yeah, I'm trying (and probably failing) to be funny there, but the example is actually a good one.

The reason that you cannot make a complete copy of a SIM card is that the designers wanted it that way. It is a security feature. It is deliberate. The card contains several parts. One is FLASH memory, which you can copy. Another is an encryption engine, which you can operate, but it's just hardware. The encryption engine is the bit with access to the key, and it ain't givin' it up unless somebody finds an undocumented way to cause it to.

As you saw in the video, old SIM cards were vulnerable to brute force attacks, but as far as I know, that's as good as it gets with regard to getting the key off of a card. The people who designed these things didn't even want that to work, which is why newer ones have taken steps against it.

DataPhreak
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:36 pm

Post by DataPhreak »

Okay, so the encryption engine is proprietary to the service provider. And that's the only thing you can't get. What about the identification of sims? If you can download your BANNED and all those other acronyms, can you change them?

For example, lets say you have 2 cards from the same provider, and one of them is for an old account that is out of service, but you still have the old phone, and would like to continue to use it.

Your other phone is fully functional and operational. It's an exact duplicate of the original. (gotta love free phones.) can the identification on the old sim not be changed and placed in the new one, if you have access to that information? Since they are both on the same service carrier, they should both have the same key, right?

lou
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:39 am

Post by lou »

DataPhreak wrote:For example, lets say you have 2 cards from the same provider, and one of them is for an old account that is out of service, but you still have the old phone, and would like to continue to use it.
The phone has to authenticate to the carrier. To do that, it has to have the proper key, which is the part you can't copy. Just saying who you are isn't good enough. You have to be able to prove it. This is explained in the video.

SolidSilver
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 11:29 am

Post by SolidSilver »

DataPhreak wrote:For example, lets say you have 2 cards from the same provider, and one of them is for an old account that is out of service, but you still have the old phone, and would like to continue to use it.
You put the new SIM card in the old phone. Et voila! I do this all the time, switching between my HTC Wizard and an old beater Moto flip. That's the beauty of SIM (and a major reason I went GSM).

Cloning a SIM card isn't necessary for legitimate use. Besides, if you have 2 phones with the same SIM on the network at the same time, flags will go up.

uberscientist
 
Posts: 57
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2008 10:49 pm

Post by uberscientist »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnY7UVyaFiQ

Get the Ki using that method. I want that lab :(

Locked
Please be positive and constructive with your questions and comments.

Return to “Citizen Engineer (closed)”